Butch chicks and straight dudes

Hey straight guys: do you ever find butch women hot?

My ex basically told me that if I ever want to be attractive to men, I need to femme it up. I'm not even categorically butch by appearance; most of what I wear is fairly gender-neutral, since I'm uncomfortable with explicitly feminine clothing but at my current size don't properly fit into men's clothing that I would otherwise wear. I have shoulder-length hair, but only because my brother's fiancee asked me not to cut it short before their wedding next month (it's getting whacked off the next day, believe me). The only makeup I wear is cover up over some acne scars and redness.

But according to her, I need to not cut my hair, wear more makeup, and stop heading straight for the men's section whenever I go to Target if I want a guy to look twice.

However, I find this very hard to believe. I know that a lot of men like femme women, since that's what society sets up as ideal, and there's a good chance that in my ideal look men will assume I'm a lesbian and therefore unavailable. But people also like what they like, regardless of social indoctrination. And since almost all of the men I know are gay, I have nowhere else to ask this question.

I think I have the same problem. Most straight women can't date guys who are prettier than they are.

TigersEyeDowsing wrote:I think I have the same problem. Most straight women can't date guys who are prettier than they are.

But then there are the ones that *like* the pretty boys!

Boy toys! Yay!

Genocon, I'm not a man so I can't really answer your question. I started a thread about "What Not to Wear" though which is about what one is saying by the way one dresses. What do you think you are saying with the clothes that you want to wear?

I don't wear makeup that often. Mostly, it is not worth the effort.
I had makeup on at my wedding. My pics still look weird to me.

that is amazing Tiger, "most straight women don't like men prettier then they are". How sad.

Interesting (to me anyway, must be the photographer in me) . Is how many degrees. A man can look pretty without looking feminine. And then there are men that do look more like girls. Still lovely IMO or they can be.

You Tiger are lovely, but you don't look feminine at least not to me going by your pics, however you are pretty. I like pretty people

I myself a female do not wear make. (I am lazy) Even when I dressed up a few weeks ago I did not wear make up. Even though I like mascara, did not wear it. When I was 14 years old I could apply it like a pro, now I could not find my face if I tried.
Still, I do seem to attract men, occasionally. At least when I dress up a little, (No, I dont mean fancy dress) Dress up for me is anything with out paint on it

And I think Women can be beautiful regardless of how feminine or not they look, but can't speak for men.
I personally do not think hair length should matter. How you (generic you) dress probably does, and the vibes of availability as well.

off topic : Watch out though, (generally speaking again) I discovered some years back that vibes of vulnerability brings in vultures. (Not the loveable bird kind, the creepy people kind).

Er, I am a butch chick. (I just got a visual of a fuzzy chick in Harley Davidson boots, wearing a leather wallet with a chain attached, wearing a leather cap.) Sorry for the digression.....I wish I could help you out but, well, femme is truly not in my vocabulary. I am the preppy slacks and loafers type myself. I doubt that this is going to help...In work mode it's jeans, shirts with collars and sneakers. For dress up I prefer Hawaiian shirts, sandals and khaki pants.

Tiger, I LIKE pretty men! Must be the broken genetic code in my make-up. Yipe!!!! Not THAT make-up!

Genocon wrote:Hey straight guys: do you ever find butch women hot?

Yes, and no. It's really a combination of things. I will say that from my point of view, there is really nothing hotter than a woman who can be butch, and still come off as feminine. Some of the hottest women I know wear little to no make-up, wear t-shirts and blue jeans, and have no problem getting out and doing traditionally "guy" things. Yet there is no mistaking that they are women. I think that is what does it for me. A woman who you can go camping, hunting, etc, with.

I think the character that best shows this would be Kate on Lost.

all

I like women, not dolls, not delicate blossoms, and certainly not Scarlett O'Hara wannabies. I don't like women in makeup, frankly my only use for painted ladies was on hourly rates, and that far in the past.

Society can try programming me all they want, my genetics is that of a thousand generations of warriors; what good is a weak woman to a strong man? Will a delicate blossom defend your hearth and children when you are on foreign soil or buried beneath it? Will a debutant be able to hew wood, haul water, and break ground for what you wish to claim as your own?

Weakness has little appeal to me. Artifice and fashion even less. I am strong, hard, and bold. I cannot tolerate women that I must always guard against overwhelming, intimidating, or dominating. Give me a woman who gives as good as she gets, who can be free to be as strong as she can be, knowing that strength calls to strength, and feminine power calls to masculine power.

Deep down I'm not that civilized (shocker). I am a barbarian who views honest ability as far sexier than delicate fragility. Not to mention delicate fragility is not up to the passion generated by 270 pounds of hardworking testosterone laden friskiness.

Ah, John you are the sort of man I like the most. I was raised by strong people, men and women. My Aunt Leela could sling a fifty pound feed sack half way across the barn. She could also go out and dance most men into the ground.

My mother and her sisters were the same.

I know we've been having the 'appearance' discussion here and else where. I appreciate it. I also think that clothes don't make the person. What makes the person is the heart, soul, brain, determination and will that is inside each of us.

All this makes me feel better about the paint on my clothes that comes from painting a house, building a house and working to keep it a house. My hiking and work boots are well worn. I am feminine, but I am by NO MEANS a girly girl. I broke my thumb some years back digging a foundation hole(s) (trench) for my house, ..................................and kept digging

Personally speaking, I need a woman who knows when to be feminine and delicate, and knows when it's time to pee in the woods.

Oh Tiger, That really says it all doesn't it?

yup...

Now that I'm awake I'll post a more lengthy response. Obviously I'm not the best person to ask this question to, but hey, now that some women have answered I guess I can throw mine in the mix.

I'm more like Vorrin in the sense that I'm attracted to a well-kept girl. Long, taken care-of hair, makeup, attractive clothing. Let's face it, you can have a beautiful soul but that's not what sells the package- You don't pass a chick on the sidewalk and say wow, check out that soul! The looks are the snare and then the rest of the package depends on whether you keep it or throw it back.

My ex was very feminine, which I liked, but it was to the extreme point that she couldn't pee outside - so that eliminated long country drives, hiking, and camping. Also when we were out of state on vacation we somehow managed to lose her makeup bag and had to come back home. So there is a balance. Sometimes it's okay to pee in the woods. Sometimes it's okay to go without makeup for five minutes.

We're all attracted to different things of course, like we've proven on this thread. I swing more to the very feminine-looking angle. Then I have a lot of butch lesbian friends. If I saw a butch girl out I wouldn't be physically attracted but I'd say hey, look, a new friend.

I'm really getting a kick out of this thread ... I like reading about what y'all like.

TED, I've got a funny peeing in the woods story btw.... but it takes a few drinks to get out of me.

Well Geno, my first response to your op is to suggest that you ignore whatever your ex shared with you (especially if you didn't ask his opinion first) From my experience, what matters more than trying to morph into something acceptable by someone else's standards is focusing on the things that make you feel fan-frickin-tastic about being you; things that celebrate the real 'you.' I'd also encourage you to put yourself in situations where you can live out your passion... from what I've seen, that spark, that bit of magic in doing what you love radiates through a person; it makes a person come alive (which is very helpful in finding a potential mate.) Moreso, people can live with passion when they are comfortable in their own skin, bringing us back to the art of feeling fantastic.

I'm so close to hopping about the 'what not to wear' thread I just love that show. What I love (in addition to the fantasy that maybe, one day, someone will give me 5K to shop in New York) is watching people transform from feeling unloved/not-good-enough to feeling like the most beautiful and amazing person around. It isn't really the clothes or makeup, I don't think. I think it's having people around who believe in you. Like when the dude that cuts hair says to the person in the chair 'you've got amazing eyes, lets snip here and here to show them off' ... the emphasis isn't on the snip, snip... the emphasis is on the reinforcement that she has amazing eyes.... and should feel good about that.

In short, I don't think you need to go all foo-foo bunny to attract a mate. But you can focus on being the best, most healthy you possible.


..... another funny story comes to mind regarding the idea of a woman being a little 'blossom' ... once I was hiking with a group and one of the members was a very very butch gal who was picking up on me; her line was that I was like a flower just beginning to open

I should have said 'I ain't no flower .... I'm the type of gal who pees in the woods when necessary (and does a poor job of it)

TigersEyeDowsing wrote:Now that I'm awake I'll post a more lengthy response. Obviously I'm not the best person to ask this question to, but hey, now that some women have answered I guess I can throw mine in the mix.

I'm more like Vorrin in the sense that I'm attracted to a well-kept girl. Long, taken care-of hair, makeup, attractive clothing. Let's face it, you can have a beautiful soul but that's not what sells the package- You don't pass a chick on the sidewalk and say wow, check out that soul! The looks are the snare and then the rest of the package depends on whether you keep it or throw it back.

My ex was very feminine, which I liked, but it was to the extreme point that she couldn't pee outside - so that eliminated long country drives, hiking, and camping. Also when we were out of state on vacation we somehow managed to lose her makeup bag and had to come back home. So there is a balance. Sometimes it's okay to pee in the woods. Sometimes it's okay to go without makeup for five minutes.

We're all attracted to different things of course, like we've proven on this thread. I swing more to the very feminine-looking angle. Then I have a lot of butch lesbian friends. If I saw a butch girl out I wouldn't be physically attracted but I'd say hey, look, a new friend.

I think it depends on what you are looking for. To me, the foo-foo, or "well kept" as tiger put it always seemed a bit like little figurines. More decorative than functional. Don't get me wrong, I've taken my share for a ride, but at the end of the day they really seem more style than substance. If I were just looking for something to play with and didn't care so much about the long term, the done up girl would probably win out. However, I married a girl who looks roughly feminine, and is not afraid to get her hands dirty.

Can I objectify women any more, geesh!

Anyway, I think the point to all this is that there is no one answer. If you are looking to attract a certain type of person, they you may want to look into different styles yourself. In the end though, it would do no good to pretend to be something other than what you are in order to attract a specific type. If your not being yourself, that is just asking for trouble.

all

allthegoodnamesweretaken wrote:

TigersEyeDowsing wrote:Now that I'm awake I'll post a more lengthy response. Obviously I'm not the best person to ask this question to, but hey, now that some women have answered I guess I can throw mine in the mix.

I'm more like Vorrin in the sense that I'm attracted to a well-kept girl. Long, taken care-of hair, makeup, attractive clothing. Let's face it, you can have a beautiful soul but that's not what sells the package- You don't pass a chick on the sidewalk and say wow, check out that soul! The looks are the snare and then the rest of the package depends on whether you keep it or throw it back.

My ex was very feminine, which I liked, but it was to the extreme point that she couldn't pee outside - so that eliminated long country drives, hiking, and camping. Also when we were out of state on vacation we somehow managed to lose her makeup bag and had to come back home. So there is a balance. Sometimes it's okay to pee in the woods. Sometimes it's okay to go without makeup for five minutes.

We're all attracted to different things of course, like we've proven on this thread. I swing more to the very feminine-looking angle. Then I have a lot of butch lesbian friends. If I saw a butch girl out I wouldn't be physically attracted but I'd say hey, look, a new friend.

I think it depends on what you are looking for. To me, the foo-foo, or "well kept" as tiger put it always seemed a bit like little figurines. More decorative than functional. Don't get me wrong, I've taken my share for a ride, but at the end of the day they really seem more style than substance. If I were just looking for something to play with and didn't care so much about the long term, the done up girl would probably win out. However, I married a girl who looks roughly feminine, and is not afraid to get her hands dirty.

Can I objectify women any more, geesh!

Anyway, I think the point to all this is that there is no one answer. If you are looking to attract a certain type of person, they you may want to look into different styles yourself. In the end though, it would do no good to pretend to be something other than what you are in order to attract a specific type. If your not being yourself, that is just asking for trouble.

all

Boys like you (and my husband) need a girl who is just as happy camping as looking girly.

Possibly a little more happy camping than looking girly, but yeah, I'd say ya got the point.

allthegoodnamesweretaken wrote:Possibly a little more happy camping than looking girly, but yeah, I'd say ya got the point.

And vice versa for me.

We watched Sophia Bush in The Hitcher remake last night. Oy.

My experience with men has been that they like you au natural when they want snuggling but when they take you to the Marine Corp Ball they want you to look like a million dollars.

Haha, I guess that's true.

John T Mainer wrote:I like women, not dolls, not delicate blossoms, and certainly not Scarlett O'Hara wannabies. I don't like women in makeup, frankly my only use for painted ladies was on hourly rates, and that far in the past.

Society can try programming me all they want, my genetics is that of a thousand generations of warriors; what good is a weak woman to a strong man? Will a delicate blossom defend your hearth and children when you are on foreign soil or buried beneath it? Will a debutant be able to hew wood, haul water, and break ground for what you wish to claim as your own?

Weakness has little appeal to me. Artifice and fashion even less. I am strong, hard, and bold. I cannot tolerate women that I must always guard against overwhelming, intimidating, or dominating. Give me a woman who gives as good as she gets, who can be free to be as strong as she can be, knowing that strength calls to strength, and feminine power calls to masculine power.

Deep down I'm not that civilized (shocker). I am a barbarian who views honest ability as far sexier than delicate fragility. Not to mention delicate fragility is not up to the passion generated by 270 pounds of hardworking testosterone laden friskiness.

AMEN BROTHER!!!!

BOYS

You gotta love them, right cap?

They are so silly!!